time necessary to dissolve e-scrap

[Ag and Au]

I may be over (?) thinking it. One thing we never seem to see is an answer such as “put a pound of pins in a gallon of AP and give it 10 days”.

Thank you guys for your input. I will perform this 1 Kg pin experiment soon (in plenty of aerated, bright green CuCl2) and post all of the details.

 

[Yggdrasil]

Thank you guys for your input. I will perform this 1 Kg pin experiment soon (in plenty of aerated, dark brown CuCl2) and post all of the details.

When active the Cupric Chloride etch is bright green.

 

[Shark]

When I was actively using copper chloride I had on hand a 5 gallon bucket with 3 to 31/2 gallons in it. I ran a rather large aquarium pump in it and it ran 24/7. I used a portable oxygen generator at times, especially when running pins. Large, high quality pins I kept separate and used a cell on them. I seldom saved pins of low quality in quantities as I always dumped them to this bucket and recovered the gold when ever I had slow time. I also used a smaller bucket with drain holes in it so I could lift the material and drain it. For pins I used a piece of cut to fit, fiberglass window screen to allow the gold out, but keep the pins in until completely broken down. This screen was a double weave material with exceptionally small pores. It was higher priced but worth it. I also used it under filters in my Büchner funnel when needed.

 

[Ag and Au]

I also used a smaller bucket with drain holes in it so I could lift the material and drain it.

I have a 3 liter Borosilicate 3.3 Glass beaker and a properly sized plastic strainer basket on order (hopefully HDPE) to replicate what you stated above. The nice thing about the current New England winter is that I can think, read and plan my upcoming processes and be ready to properly refine outdoors in April....Thanks..

 

[patnor1011]

It can also be done faster with iodine/iodide leach or thiourea cell.

 

[andu]

Sorry to get into your thread but i don't seem to be allowed to post on any of the two subforums i deemed right.
I have this:





16.4 grams including the bag, they come from credit cards that were destinated for disposal, I wanted to count them but eeh, I estimate atleast 100 pieces with a bit of plastic between whatever is the name of those things. I covered them in 24% hcl and added 1 ml of bleach, I really don't wanna do too much bleach which, btw, smells horrible.
My question is, how much bleach should I add? Besides the horrible smell the one milliliter didn't start any reaction, I let it be about 20m ago.
Edit: About one hour in, I added another 3ml, still nothing, bleach weak? is it supposed to be slow? given i have it at around 4ºc?

 

[Yggdrasil]

Sorry to get into your thread but i don't seem to be allowed to post on any of the two subforums i deemed right.
I have this:

View attachment 61760



16.4 grams including the bag, they come from credit cards that were destinated for disposal, I wanted to count them but eeh, I estimate atleast 100 pieces with a bit of plastic between whatever is the name of those things. I covered them in 24% hcl and added 1 ml of bleach, I really don't wanna do too much bleach which, btw, smells horrible.
My question is, how much bleach should I add? Besides the horrible smell the one milliliter didn't start any reaction, I let it be about 20m ago.
Edit: About one hour in, I added another 3ml, still nothing, bleach weak? is it supposed to be slow? given i have it at around 4ºc?

Some forums are a part of the Library or are locked due to their valuable content.
There are always alternatives or mirrors.

So no incineration??
No base metal removal??

There is basically next to no Gold in the foils on these, the majority is inside the chip on the backside.

 

[andu]

I still need to know what's bleach to hcl ratio. Only metals i seen is gold and copper, and i don't mind copper if i cement the gold with it. If i get clean plastic at the end i'm happy, this is slower than i thought, some foils breaking off the plastic but not much dissolving, bit of copper.

 

[Yggdrasil]

I still need to know what's bleach to hcl ratio. Only metals i seen is gold and copper, and i don't mind copper if i cement the gold with it. If i get clean plastic at the end i'm happy, this is slower than i thought, some foils breaking off the plastic but not much dissolving, bit of copper.

HCl/Bleach is a bit sensitive, since heat will increase reaction and at the same time drive off the Chlorine effectively stop the reaction.
Additionally the Bleach itself neutralizes the HCl.
Bleach needs to be store cold since it will decompose both with time and heat.

So I'd say there is no set ratio for those same reasons.

I use either HCl Peroxide or HCl pool Chlorine.
Never tried HCl/Bleach.

If you insist using it, add just a drop at the time and plenty of stirring and a good cover/lid.

 

[kurtak]

16.4 grams including the bag, they come from credit cards

Those are actually an IC chip which means they have gold bond wires "inside" of them so if you just leach them for the gold plating on the "outside" you will be recovering only some of the gold

That means to recover all the gold (plating on outside AND bond wires on inside) they need to be incinerated & then milled/ground up & then the ash can be ether leached or smelted

I estimate atleast 100 pieces

They are also VERY low grade recovery so with only 100 of them you will be "lucky" if you even get a tenth of a gram gold AND that is if you recover BOTH the plating & the bond wires

I covered them in 24% hcl and added 1 ml of bleach,

HCl/bleach is a poor choice for leaching &/or at least it will take A LOT more then 1 ml bleach (&/or a few ml) of bleach to leach them & that is because the bleach (which is the oxidized) needs to dissolve not just the gold but the copper under the gold plating - as well bleach is not real effective at dissolving the bond wires even though the bond wires are "small"

Even if you do manage to get all the metal (copper/gold) dissolved with the HCl/bleach good luck getting ALL the values washed/filter out of the ash - in the end (with leaching) you will end up with a lot of very diluted solution with very little gold in it

You are better served to smelt (along with a collector metal) this kind of low grade stuff & even then do it along with other low grade stuff & in batches big enough to make the recovery worth while

For what it is worth

Kurt

 

[kurtak]

and i don't mind copper if i cement the gold with it.

There is another problem - the chips are glued into the credit card - so with leaching - when "some" of the gold dissolves - then cements back out because of the copper - the ULTRA fine gold particles that cement out are going to get "stuck" on/in the glue - it (the gold) is now lost

They MUST be incinerate BEFORE leaching (&/or smelting) or you will most certainly loose gold --- on material that is VERY LOW recovery in the first place

The path you have chosen here is with very low recovery material in the first place & with your method you will be lucky to recover any gold at all - especially on such a small batch of very low recovery material

Kurt

 

[andu]

I simply want to get rid of all plastic, which i will re-process with proper reactants I will reuse and then just as with whatever doesn't dissolve I will save for later, I do want to save the sillicon aswell.


I initially wanted to test the two telecom-grade PCBs foils, which most were probably dissolved in AP, but since they been in that filter for so long and these been here for nearly a year (note I removed the chips from each CC individually then disposed of the plastic properly.) and I wanted to see an actual yield...
I don't believe it is little, excluding the amount, given that today cards are silvery looking, not goldish or gold.

The foils I do want to melt along with tin but i'm uncertain of it's purity given that after long periods molten it's melting temp raises.

I'm don't plan of disposing of anything, if I did have the means I would recycle water without going thru the center.

Edit: Just added a stream of bleach and a lot of foils released, a bit of bubbling, solution turned a nice transparent emerald green, starting to look better.
After mixing, it became dark green, added a bit more of hcl and leaving it for a while before more bleach addition, foils are separating and probably dissolving, waiting to see all that plastic clear.

Looks nice, it is first time i go for actual foils and gold. Under 24h since I started it.
Note I do this as a hobby.

Edit2: I just added another good bunch of bleach before making the 24h and nearly all foils dissolved suddenly, I will add some more hcl later after the full day and get rid of last two pieces that are nearly untouched.

 

[patnor1011]

When all of the gold dissolve from top part of that chip then strain, filter solution. Your gold will be in solution, some may be stuck as black powder on any undissolved metal still on chips. Still this is just a small part of gold which they contain as there is most likely more gold in bonding wires than on plating you can see.
You need to incinerate them, mill to fine powder (mortar and pestle may suffice) and powder needs to be leached again to get bonding wires. HCl and bleach are not good for this.
Do not use tin if you want to smelt it with collector metal. I say it again, under no circumstances introduce tin in that.

 

[andu]

Filtered, the only thing left was the silicon chips and maybe a tiny bit of plating inbetween the plastic, since I have no smb I tossed few copper thin cable hairs, but i'm now regreting it, had to wait for smb.
It is coating on the copper but not piling up noticeably.
Now i'm bored and no idea what i should start processing next .

 

[andu]

There's a tiny bit of junk on the bottom (one or two plastic foils) A bit of carbon on the bottom since, hate to admit, I used a candle to warm it up in the past.
The copper is completely gone and I have no stannous to test, the fine particles of gold in suspension eventually fall down, given they were fine i also guess the amount is very small. I still have all the IC's but i'm not doing any crushing or burning here. This is the result of around 16g of credit card chips.

I still have about a kg of scsi pcb's and another of ide with a few satas, and a kilo of ram which I put up for sale but if no one wants to pick I will definetly refine.

I'm curious about how much in the chips, I don't believe they started using silver on the cards instead of gold for nothing.

Would also like to get a damn yield on the telecom grade boards.

Edit: I just checked and the plastic and IC's have atleast 50% of original weight.

 

[Bitcollector]

There's a tiny bit of junk on the bottom (one or two plastic foils) A bit of carbon on the bottom since, hate to admit, I used a candle to warm it up in the past.
The copper is completely gone and I have no stannous to test, the fine particles of gold in suspension eventually fall down, given they were fine i also guess the amount is very small. I still have all the IC's but i'm not doing any crushing or burning here. This is the result of around 16g of credit card chips.

I still have about a kg of scsi pcb's and another of ide with a few satas, and a kilo of ram which I put up for sale but if no one wants to pick I will definetly refine.

I'm curious about how much in the chips, I don't believe they started using silver on the cards instead of gold for nothing.

Would also like to get a damn yield on the telecom grade boards.

Edit: I just checked and the plastic and IC's have atleast 50% of original weight.

The silver and the gold on the face of the CC is based on the color of the card, and value of the card sometimes. Gold can be used for higher value CC cards. They still use gold and silver.

Gold is used for dark colored cards, and silver is used for lighter colored cards. It's usually about color matching.

Also, CC cards are often kept under VERY secure procedures, and NOBODY gets them to remove the gold from them. The manufacturing company takes them to a refinery, by Brinks.

I wouldn't be telling too many people you got them, unless you want to start answering questions about where you got them, and your friend gets in trouble. Haha.

 

[andu]

They were all older models and all of them were gold plated, I actually never seen silver plate cc's till not so long ago.
Given I weren't given instructions about them and I took care of destroying all the data, i think i'm fine altho I do agree with you.
On the other hand, most of it is now probably in my copper stockpot .

Btw, I dissolved a HDD platter in HCL and the remnant foil looks pretty solid.

 

[Martijn]

I have a 3 liter Borosilicate 3.3 Glass beaker and a properly sized plastic strainer basket on order (hopefully HDPE) to replicate what you stated above. The nice thing about the current New England winter is that I can think, read and plan my upcoming processes and be ready to properly refine outdoors in April....Thanks..

Orded a bucket with holes? I used a 3mm drill. On a see though PE bucket. The bucket sits in another identical bucket. No glass beaker needed to look inside.

 

[Bitcollector]

Btw, I dissolved a HDD platter in HCL and the remnant foil looks pretty solid.

Hey! Wait as min, I have some too.

 

[andu]

Hey! Wait as min, I have some too.

I hear quite diverse things about them, all I can say for the while is that it takes a looooot of hcl, i'm hoping i can slowly evaporate the water and be left with solid dry aluminum chloride?